TR TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet

Afif said:

For TF35000, 4K service hours would be quite reasonable to begin with. Later Improvements can be introduced in stages.

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No,either perfect or not.
Then why go for indigenous when it is inferior to the competitors(western engines)?

TR_123456 said:

No,either perfect or not.
Then why go for indigenous when it is inferior to the competitors(western engines)?

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Security of Supply chain is much more important than marginally better product. No doubt. Eg: Altay

TR_123456 said:

No,either perfect or not.
Then why go for indigenous when it is inferior to the competitors(western engines)?

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So that we can have an engine of our own to improve even further on. Our goal shouldn't be to compete with the Western engines, or any other kind for that matter. Our sole aim should be to have an engine we can build on our own that can fly our own platforms to meet our needs. As @Afif said, we can upgrade it later on, we shouldn't just expect perfection or the best engine of its class right away.

neosinan said:

Security of Supply chain is much more important than marginally better product. No doubt. Eg: Altay

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So,we didnt think of that ?
Basic principle of the Turkish Defence Industry.

boredaf said:

So that we can have an engine of our own to improve even further on. Our goal shouldn't be to compete with the Western engines, or any other kind for that matter. Our sole aim should be to have an engine we can build on our own that can fly our own platforms to meet our needs. As @Afif said, we can upgrade it later on, we shouldn't just expect perfection or the best engine of its class right away.

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No,we need an engine to make the KAAN a true 5th gen Fighter Jet,not an engine we can work on.
We can keep using the F-110 until then.
The minimum is a 35000lbf class engine in 2028 to have a production line ready in 2030.
TF6000/TF10000 all good but these engines are not the base for a 35k engine,am i wrong @Yasar_TR abi?

Afif said:

Why would be pathetic? Russian AL-41F1S also has 4k hours service life. GE F414 utilized in Hornet, Super hornet, KF21, Tejas, Gripen also has 4k hours lifespan.



For TF35000, 4K service hours would be quite reasonable to begin with. Later Improvements can be introduced in stages.

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Why should GE claim:

quote:

Reduced life-cycle cost​

GE Aerospace’s F414 features the latest technologies to enhance engine performance, improve engine durability, and reduce life-cycle cost (LCC) for current and future operators of next-generation combat aircraft.

unquote

If the f414 has less life than f404.


Let us not mix “overhaul lifecycle” with “engine lifespan”.

f414 is essentially the same engine as the f404 with a larger fan that increases thrust.

just a few numbers I found online:

F414 : overhaul used to be every 2000hrs now 4000hours,
Engine life: 6-8000hrs
RR's EJ200 : Overhaul every 2000hrs,
Engine life : 6000hrs
Klimov's RD-33 : Overhaul every 300 hours,
Engine max life : 1000hrs
AL-31: Overhaul every 1,000 hours,
Engine life : 4000hrs

Going back to Turkish engine situation; we know that TS1400 is not too far beyond its foreign equivalent. It is constantly being evolved too.
TEI manufactures T700 TEI 701D engine for the Blackhawk helicopters. Production involves additive technologies and hot sections including locally produced single crystals.
First of all if GE were not happy with TEI’s hot section parts, those parts wouldn’t be on that engine. Secondly Turkish armed forces wouldn’t accept a Blackhawk helicopter with an engine fitted with inferior life and performance parameters.

So any indigenous engine KAAN will have, will not be too far beyond western equivalents.

TR_123456 said:

TF6000/TF10000 all good but these engines are not the base for a 35k engine,am i wrong @Yasar_TR abi?

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In view of Dr Aksit’s statements, we need to know that TF6K/TF10K engines were going to be used as stepping stones to the bigger engine. It was supposed to physically prove to TEI what was being designed in the computer is now a fact in real life.
Logic says that the construction design of TF6K lends itself to a stealthy engine. If this is what we have achieved, then it is also logical to think that we carry on with this tech on to the bigger engine. But there is so much secrecy about the TF35K that if we are going to hit the 2028 deadline for first flight then we need parts being produced now. So what you say may be the case.

Yasar_TR said:

Why should GE claim:

quote:

Reduced life-cycle cost​

GE Aerospace’s F414 features the latest technologies to enhance engine performance, improve engine durability, and reduce life-cycle cost (LCC) for current and future operators of next-generation combat aircraft.

unquote

If the f414 has less life than f404.

F414 Engine | GE Aerospace

F414Engine

www.geaerospace.com

Let us not mix “overhaul lifecycle” with “engine lifespan”.

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Oops you are right, I wrote it from my memory. It gotten mixed.

Temel Kotil

• Kaan being delivered in 2028 will be 100% domestic including engine and ejection seat!

Sounds they are now even more confident about TF35K

Agha Sher said:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1788959083229299085

Temel Kotil

• Kaan being delivered in 2028 will be 100% domestic including engine and ejection seat!

Sounds they are now even more confident about TF35K

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This is absurd. There must be some misunderstanding.

Agha Sher said:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1788959083229299085

Temel Kotil

• Kaan being delivered in 2028 will be 100% domestic including engine and ejection seat!

Sounds they are now even more confident about TF35K

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If he really did say that: He did say only "yerli", not "milli". This could mean that F110 engines will be produced in Türkiye.

Such statements just confuse the people, raise the expectations and put pressure on the engineers/technicians working on those projects.

Sometimes, speech is silver and silence gold.

Rodeo said:

This is absurd. There must be some misunderstanding.

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As long as the report doesn't come from Temel Kotil himself, I don't believe anyone, neither person A or B.
The truthfulness of this Tweet is absolutely and 100% worth nothing.
I can also make up a name as a nickname and put the Turkish flag in my profile picture and claim that Turkey will build the Death Star and Star Destroyer in Star Wars in 5 years. Don't fall for people like that....

CAN_TR said:

Such statements just confuse the people, raise the expectations and put pressure on the engineers/technicians working on those projects.

Sometimes, speech is silver and silence gold.

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In a democracy,sometimes need to do promotion in public and Parliament.

Delay is quite normal in any country.

Strong AI said:

If he really did say that: He did say only "yerli", not "milli". This could mean that F110 engines will be produced in Türkiye.

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F110 is not a Yerli, most of the components, including key components, come from overseas, and the final assembly, if any, is done here. I don't know if you can still call something like this a Yerli....
To me, it's nothing more than a lukewarm fart with a slightly wet finish.... if it this yerli.
But we have an engine to close the gap, the Americans could have said no. You can't forget that either.

IC3M@N FX said:

F110 is not a Yerli, most of the components, including key components, come from overseas, and the final assembly, if any, is done here. I don't know if you can still call something like this a Yerli....
To me, it's nothing more than a lukewarm fart with a slightly wet finish.... if it this yerli.
But we have an engine to close the gap, the Americans could have said no. You can't forget that either.

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Do you know what "if", "could" and "will be" do mean?
Who said that F110 is "yerli" right now?

B_A said:

In a democracy,sometimes need to do promotion in public and Parliament.

Delay is quite normal in any country.

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For example the super japanese engine IHI Corporation XF9,which the members of here used to argued with me that i looked down japanese.


They didnt have any news since 2018

Strong AI said:

If he really did say that: He did say only "yerli", not "milli". This could mean that F110 engines will be produced in Türkiye.

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That's what I thought.

TF35K could fly in 10 years at best.

Agha Sher said:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1788959083229299085

Temel Kotil

• Kaan being delivered in 2028 will be 100% domestic including engine and ejection seat!

Sounds they are now even more confident about TF35K

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Naayır, nolamaz!
No way!

Agha Sher said:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1788959083229299085

Temel Kotil

• Kaan being delivered in 2028 will be 100% domestic including engine and ejection seat!

Sounds they are now even more confident about TF35K

Click to expand...

I know some people are not going to like this, but I don't believe anything Temel Kotil says anymore. Over the last year or two, his salesman approach to crucial project (overpromising and overselling his product) is seriously irritating me.

And not just that, statements like this just paints a rosy picture for general public who are not that informed about how defence industry works (and let's be honest, for some who should know as well) and create unnecessary grumbling when any sort of delay or problem comes up.